Dreamland scheme to cost £300m, also Margate FM

[dreamland]

this is an article in the thanet times from yesturday. dreamland owners are planning a radio station for part of the new development at the old margate fun fair, boss toby hunter said his company is going ahead with there own plans after a deal to sell the site fell through on valentines day. aswell as shops and resturants overlooking the sea margate town centre regeneration company want to build homes and convert the old cinema in to a small concert venue. mr hunter envisages the back of the cinema clad in glass that could be opened to allow outdoor gigs aswell. mr hunter said the company would like to see a radio station take up residence at the cinema broadcasting to the local area. the company wants to build a heritage seaside fun fair around the existing scenic railway, which is protected by law, using rides saved from other theme parks. the shops , some 120,000 sq ft of space, would be an enclosed mall with 30,000 sq ft of resturants on the first floor. the whole scheme is predicted to cost £300 million. mr hunter said his firm , which includes businessman jimmy godden as a major shareholder, would be ready to go in to talks with thanet council next month to put a draft plan for consulation. he said some work has allready been done on flood risk and roads. he said they have allready been in talks with other partners to work on elements of the scheme. paigle properties , which allso owns the old seabathing hospital site in westbrook and the lido in cliftonville, was due to buy the dreamland site for £30 million . mr hunter said on febuary 14th we served notice to end the contract and are now mooving ahead with our own plans. the six month delay has been frustrating but we are delighted to be the owners of dreamland and look foward to delivering an exiting project for margate.

[vince69619]

If they are so keen to build a heritage park, does this mean some maintenance for the scenic is about to occur?

Vince.

[zamfir]

They could always use the £1.3 million "already banked" deposit from Paigle, as with/without the Heritage Park, the Scenic remains.

Wonder why she pulled out again?

[uvegotmale2000]

building shops and restuarants is NOT going to entice people to flock to margate
so they want the heritage park to go ahead,well mr hunter i dont trust you,heard your promises before,like you was going to open scenic railway last year,and never happened,and no maintenance since 2006!

herigate park YES

shops and restuarants NO

they are many empty shops in margate boarded up or otherwise,use them for you rubbish ideas and let dreamland live on

[Zoidstar]

If redeveloping part of the site secures the future of the scenic than surley its a good thing, it must be better than the curent state of limbo the scenic is in.

By letting part of the site be developed part of the money rised from the developments could be set a side for the restoration and on going up keep of the scenic and any other rides that could be part of a heritage park.

If you baned development of the entire site than where else are funds going to come from,

I know this view will nto meet with aproval from anyone else but I have friends in the real estate trade who have sold off parcels of land all around to country to enable the origianl land holder to carry on trading or improviang facilitys at the musem, gallery or park that the land was sold at (no names will be given) its a proven way of securing a steady income.

People need to see the bigger picture and understand that keeping the entire site as a theme park is probably just not viable

[uvegotmale2000]

i bet if philip miller had his hands on the whole dreamland site he would turn margate's fotunes round ,just like he did in southend.The whole dreamland site IS viable,else Bembom brothers and the early part of Jimmy Goddens;s reign the park would have been empty

the last few years when dreamland has been able to operate it has been met with awkwardness from the site's owners so the site is deemed unfit for trade.

ii personally think philip miller could turn dreamland into a hugw attraction with crowds to match within 2 years.

building flats on the site is a minefield in the future.i bet you after a year or so there be many complaints from the flats residents (if anyone bought one) from the noise of amusement park.and then what?restrictions on opening times,late opening at weekends etc

if toby hunter wants restuarants at dreamland and shops who's is gonna bother coming to margate for holidays or days out,answer is no-one

ive always been against any development at dreamland other than a theme park,cause in the long run it would be the biggest mistake thanet council will have ever done.

Once that site has gone it will be gone forever and margate will disappear just like other towns like Morecambe and thyl

complete proof that their amusement parks closed and funnily enough tourists stopped coming too,and they have more closed shops than margate

margate will become another morecambe soon if development of these silly plans takes place.a small strip of land for a park is not going to get people to flock to margate.its just not good enough.

just think how good the park could be with a new onwer willing to take on the whole site for a park,

jim douglas had nice suggestions on what theming could be done to make the park more attractive if used properly..i still believe fighting development of half the park demise is the right way to go.

also i thought the council wasnt going to give permission for building works unless the park had been proved to be unviable,funnily enough this has yet to be proved

[Jim Douglas Jr.]

Maybe it's just because parks tend to be larger here, but Dreamland as half the size it is now won't be worth diddly.

It's not a very big of a park as is. Once they build a bunch of crap on it, it's DONE, OVER, FINISHED. Nobody's going to make a daytrip to a place you can "do" in 40 minutes.
There's plenty of places to build crap and plenty of, quite frankly, crummy looking, horrible retail all along the seafront that needs attention. Let them buy and revitalize what's already there.
Waterbridge needs to unload Dreamland and local government isn't far sighted enough to see what's at stake and actually do something about it.

The council needs to grow a set and do something to save Margate, not just allow someone to build another stupid shopping complex. That's SOOOO NOT a long term solution.

[uvegotmale2000]

Another thing that worries me that is if say Waterbridge let the heritage park built on such a tiny bit of land and then rent it out,whos to say a year down the line,they put the rent up double or even treble what it started out to be and force the park to close so they can finish what they started.

Alarm bells should be ringing,and ringing loud.
i find this latest episode very worrying indeed

[Zoidstar]

All I was saying was in its present form the park is just not viable, by developing a part of the land that is currently unused it will release funds that could be used to support the park in the longer term.

What would you prefer the Scenic slowly rotting away as it is now with no work being carried out on it eventually it will get to a point of no return and the owners can apply for a demolition order on safety grounds.

I know it’s listed but you CAN still get permission to demolish Grade 2 listed buildings even Grade 1 listed buildings can be demolished if you can prove that there is a significant risk to the public from collapse of the building or structure.

Or a part of the land is redeveloped a percentage of the money raised is put into a trust fund set up to support the park a set up like this grantees a steady income which is better than nothing coming in as is the case at present.

[vince69619]

You are correct that the park in it's present form is not viable.

But that is only because the present owners have taken away anything that made it viable. There is nothing stopping them from returning the attractions and running a viable park using the whole site, they are just choosing not to.

Vince.

[EAS]

Totally agree. Philip Miller has stated repeatedly he would take on the site, and run it as an amusement park, but as it is now, with the development brief allowing building, the cost will be too great.

Also - it's not true that can just allow it to rot then apply to demolish.

The local authority has powers to step in and make it safe.

Another thing that worries me that is if say Waterbridge let the heritage park built on such a tiny bit of land and then rent it out,whos to say a year down the line,they put the rent up double or even treble what it started out to be and force the park to close so they can finish what they started.

Alarm bells should be ringing,and ringing loud.
i find this latest episode very worrying indeed

This I agree with. In the end, without careful monitoring, there could be left only the cinema and the Scenic.

[Zoidstar]

Sorry but you can demolish a listed building if you can prove that they are in a condition likely to cause death or injury to person/s there have been a number over the last few years that it has been done to the councils in the areas the buildings were demolished did not enforce the regulations to force the owners to maintain the structure.

No work major work has been done on the scenic sine 2006 it’s a wooden structure very close the sea, the air is laden with salt which has a very high corrosive effect, the scenic I would hazard a guess is held together by metal bracing and iron pins.

When Iron/steel corrodes it expands in the case of concrete the concrete flashing is blown out enabling more water to ingress the damaged section once this happens exfoliation of the metal quickens the resulting action being the wood in the case of the scenic will be swelled and could quite easily crack and split.

Without regular check and I don’t mean just a visual and a knock on wood check.

In my humble opinion before it runs again a complete NDT check should be carried out on ALL the load bearing sections of the structure with a random selection of the joining pins holding the ride together being removed for further inspection better still replace them as even the smallest crack in a pin could prove catastrophic

The current situation with the lack of maintenance on the scenic is the major problem its owned by the land owner they can stop people going on to their land for as long as they like, if the situation with the lack of maintenance continues for too long then to
then the state of the structure is going to deteriorate further and could be proven to be not only uneconomic to restore but also unsafe to be worked on, in this situation a demolition approval can be granted.

Sorry to be the “New Bob” but I am just making a point.

[uvegotmale2000]

i wouldnt call you the new bob.the part about maintenace of the scenic makes perfect sense to me.well written too

[Zoidstar]

Thanks

Have taken courses in corrosion prevention and passed them!

All the courses are in metal corrosion, treatment and prevention not done the wood one yet but have read a couple of books on the matter all be it in the slightly more complex migraine inducing aviation field.

Unlike metal it’s a lot harder to treat wood once the rot has set in as it turns very brittle, we must all have seen some sort of rotten wood where its looks like and when you rub at it it acts very much like a Cadburys flake! (Could murder a choccy bar right now) by far the best thing to do is cut out the bad bit and replace it with a new piece.

I won’t drone on about ways to treat metal corrosion as there are different ways for different metals different chemicals for this different chemicals for that but again if a crack has started then by far the best option is to replace that part as wear and tear will eventually cause the crack to grow until it reaches a point where it will fracture whicj is not a good thing!

[Cheryl]

We were in Margate last week and had a quick look at the Scenic Railway, maintenance is certainly required sooner rather than later. We saw evidence of wood rotting and some had dropped. This neglect is mindless and makes a mockery of TDC, Waterbridge etc stating how important this building is and how plans are going to be drawn up based around the iconic scenic. Well TDC and Waterbridge prove you mean what you say, get your fingers out and get the relevant work done on it now!

Margate High Street is now imploding, Pizza Hut is boarded up, the Cottage Pub closed, Shoe Express was closing it's doors early this week and I have been told that Claires, New Look, Select and Primark will all be off by the end of the year. So good look with your shopping centre Mr Hunter - you are going to need it.